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Post by Pierre Bezukhov on Jun 17, 2017 1:16:58 GMT -6
Wikia is terrible - this isn't really something you can argue with in my opinion. The formatting is awful, the URL is bad, and the ads are just terrible.
I rent a webserver with support for webhosting and I can purchase a domain along with configuring Mediawiki to be a GC wiki. It'd just be a matter of moving all of our materials over - which because Wikia and Mediawiki support export/import pages via XML files would take like a day. It'd allow us greater control over our content and maybe it would encourage you lazy fuckers to use the Wiki more.
Discuss?
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Sunshine60
Edessian Ensign
Reports of my death have been greatly exaggerated.
Posts: 218
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Post by Sunshine60 on Jun 17, 2017 1:55:13 GMT -6
Agree. Let's do it.
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Post by Chonicler on Jun 17, 2017 7:44:00 GMT -6
I've never had problems with Wikia, and I use it quite often, while moving to an easier to use website might be beneficial in the long run, it doesn't really matter to me that much.
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Post by Sliprunner on Jun 17, 2017 8:58:32 GMT -6
I just don't see the benefits to dealing with the hassle of a move. Argue as much as you want it's better editing, we don't do extensive editing to begin with. The largest thing on my mind is will it give that drastic improvement being said? When you consider that most of the issues with editing of pages is it doesn't like the sheer volume of formatting/info on a single page, something Mediawiki will share because of similar backend.
I'll deal with it if we have to move, but I don't think it'll make much difference; However, I will make note that I use the classic editor which is far less buggy then the 'normal' one.
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Post by Pierre Bezukhov on Jun 17, 2017 11:52:45 GMT -6
I just don't see the benefits to dealing with the hassle of a move. Argue as much as you want it's better editing, we don't do extensive editing to begin with. The largest thing on my mind is will it give that drastic improvement being said? When you consider that most of the issues with editing of pages is it doesn't like the sheer volume of formatting/info on a single page, something Mediawiki will share because of similar backend. I'll deal with it if we have to move, but I don't think it'll make much difference; However, I will make note that I use the classic editor which is far less buggy then the 'normal' one. I make use of the classic editor as well and I still have significant issues with Wikia not formatting properly when working on both small and large amounts of text. I thoroughly hate Wikia and feel a move to Mediawiki would be much better for GC, even if we only use the wiki for small amounts of things.
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Efelix
Theme Designer
not a cultist, may be a communist
Posts: 845
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Post by Efelix on Jun 17, 2017 20:34:22 GMT -6
Our current wiki is a mess with no standards of quality or organization. The only vaguely usable things on it are the rules and systems and tech tree stuff. Otherwise, it's a digital snake pit that nobody wants to get too far into. Burning it down and starting anew with standards on how to organize pages, how we sort info (a page on every ship class or condense them into a single page per civilization for example), and maybe some guidelines on writing style so the wiki can be read as having a single voice will only be good for GC.
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Post by Sliprunner on Jun 17, 2017 22:20:36 GMT -6
I just don't see the benefits to dealing with the hassle of a move. Argue as much as you want it's better editing, we don't do extensive editing to begin with. The largest thing on my mind is will it give that drastic improvement being said? When you consider that most of the issues with editing of pages is it doesn't like the sheer volume of formatting/info on a single page, something Mediawiki will share because of similar backend. I'll deal with it if we have to move, but I don't think it'll make much difference; However, I will make note that I use the classic editor which is far less buggy then the 'normal' one. I make use of the classic editor as well and I still have significant issues with Wikia not formatting properly when working on both small and large amounts of text. I thoroughly hate Wikia and feel a move to Mediawiki would be much better for GC, even if we only use the wiki for small amounts of things. Again, the only time the editor is a problem for me is on huge pages like the DP system. If the Mediawiki is going to have similar formatting issues for large pages then there is no sense to moving, because all it means is we'll just be fighting with it in a different editor. As far as I can tell currently? They use the same backend for handling the formatting, which means we're just going to have the same issues in a different editor. Your making it clear you hate Wikia, but that doesn't make any alternatively magically function better. As mas pointed out, rules and guidelines on formatting could probably help, but if we're doing that we can't just do a copy and paste of the wikia (export/import), we're going to have to reformat each page to the new guidelines (and possibly break up pages as required) which completely negates the 'ease' of a transfer. Which is especially annoying considering every single time we've had a project like this, you all say you will help, then quit after 5 minutes into it. (See: Tech Branches, DP System Updates, any major change discussion [Bar E-war]) If it's really going to be this major difference in capabilities I'll deal with the move, but I'm seriously questioning if Mediawiki is going to solve the problems like you think it will.
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Post by Pierre Bezukhov on Jun 17, 2017 22:48:30 GMT -6
Our current wiki is a mess with no standards of quality or organization. The only vaguely usable things on it are the rules and systems and tech tree stuff. Otherwise, it's a digital snake pit that nobody wants to get too far into. Burning it down and starting anew with standards on how to organize pages, how we sort info (a page on every ship class or condense them into a single page per civilization for example), and maybe some guidelines on writing style so the wiki can be read as having a single voice will only be good for GC. Agreed - look at the starting page for any SS13 wiki. You have all the categories listed, the rules listed, major categories/important pages listed and in general it is so much less of a mess than ours. I opened the editor for our own homepage once and closed it out immediately because CoG did it like 3 or 4 years ago and nobody has touched it since except for quick Ctrl + F edits. I make use of the classic editor as well and I still have significant issues with Wikia not formatting properly when working on both small and large amounts of text. I thoroughly hate Wikia and feel a move to Mediawiki would be much better for GC, even if we only use the wiki for small amounts of things. Again, the only time the editor is a problem for me is on huge pages like the DP system. If the Mediawiki is going to have similar formatting issues for large pages then there is no sense to moving, because all it means is we'll just be fighting with it in a different editor. As far as I can tell currently? They use the same backend for handling the formatting, which means we're just going to have the same issues in a different editor. Your making it clear you hate Wikia, but that doesn't make any alternatively magically function better. As mas pointed out, rules and guidelines on formatting could probably help, but if we're doing that we can't just do a copy and paste of the wikia (export/import), we're going to have to reformat each page to the new guidelines (and possibly break up pages as required) which completely negates the 'ease' of a transfer. Which is especially annoying considering every single time we've had a project like this, you all say you will help, then quit after 5 minutes into it. (See: Tech Branches, DP System Updates, any major change discussion [Bar E-war]) If it's really going to be this major difference in capabilities I'll deal with the move, but I'm seriously questioning if Mediawiki is going to solve the problems like you think it will. I feel like a move to Mediawiki would let us make the GC wiki into a more professional and less of a shitty, snakepit clusterfuck with a significantly more usable editor. Considering Mediawiki is just the software that Wikipedia uses, and Wikipedia has a good editor compared to the hell that is Mediawiki? I can't see the downsides. Seriously I fucking hate Mediawiki.
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Post by Pierre Bezukhov on Jun 17, 2017 23:50:42 GMT -6
Also the ads - the ads really piss me off.
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Post by Sliprunner on Jun 18, 2017 15:41:48 GMT -6
'Ads' what kind of blocker are you using, I see no ads. In seriousness it's not even going to be a move if we have to rebuild the wiki, it's straight up creating a new wiki. Further still my concern is if it is going to have the same formatting issues in the backend that wikia has. The Editor could give you 10$ every time you use it, but that doesn't solve the problem if we're going to be fighting the same formatting issues, because all that means is we created a lot of extra work for almost no reward.
Notepad++ and Notepad are editors and both can handle .bat files, But no mater how much better notepad++ is then notepad, it won't solve the problem if the .bat file won't do what you want it to do. No matter how many times you say notepad++ is the superior editor it won't change what you can't do without issues. From what I've looked into as well we'd lose spoilers, that's an extention that has to be added in [Presumably this is easier then Wikia though]
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Post by RedDwarfIV on Jun 19, 2017 20:21:21 GMT -6
I have been basically unable to do all but the most basic edits and pageadds on the Wikia because the formatting screws up every time even though it is written the same way all the others are. Spoilers are one of the things I've had problems with.
From my perspective, if it fixes the problem, then I'll be okay with it.
And in the end, we will still have the Wikia site to refer to if necessary.
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